Grossman asked for input, so I will provide some:
> You will note that I did *not* say that 2-4 publications would get you
>either a job or a post-doc, I was merely responding to Aldo's comment
>that the standards for PhD's had changed dramatically, and that now
>4-7 papers were the standard. In fact, I didn't even dispute Aldo's
>claim for Sweeden, he knows more about the standards there than I do.
>But for U.S. phd, i can only say that 4-7 pubs. doesn't fit what i've
>seen or the dissertations of the seven phd students that i've
>supervised or the two that are currently in my lab. Can't any other
>faculty or recent phd's comment on this?
In my association with UCLA, Cornell, the University of Hawaii, the
University of Idaho, and Arizona State U., I would say that I've never seen
a PhD granted for a thesis that did not result in AT LEAST 3 major
publications. In fact, the policy at the UC is that three accepted papers
can be 'stapled togther' and constitute a 'legal' dissertation. More
generally, I would say that the vast majority of dissertations result in
3-5 papers.
>
>Finally, lets take a minute to do the math for Ron's assertions,
>because I don't think that we're all that far apart. If a student
>has done a good masters (and frankly if you want an academic or
>research position, there's no point in not doing a masters)
I disagree with the last statement. If you want an academic position, you
are much better off going straight from your Bachelors into a PhD program.
Most 'major' PhD granting institutions treat master's students like second
class citizens or use the degree to terminate PhD students who don't 'work
out'. The only situation where I think the MS is critical, is for a
student who (by virtue of a spotty academic record) can't gain access to a
top lab/program. In this case I would recommend going to a non-PhD
granting school (e.g., any school in the Cal. State school - not to be
confused with the UC system) to get a masters that will be a stepping stone
to a top program.
So, there's my two cents.
M. Grober
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Matthew S. Grober
Assistant Professor of Physiology
Department of Life Sciences
Arizona State University West Phone: (602) 543-6939
4701 W. Thunderbird Rd. FAX: (602) 543-6073
Phoenix, AZ 85069-7100 E-mail:[log in to unmask]
http://lsvl.la.asu.edu/zoology/faculty/grober.html
"No human being was ever so free as a fish."
John Ruskin
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